Hello again, everyone, and thanks for joining us for another edition of Arkansas Week.

I'm Steve Barnes.

Perhaps you know Alice.

Perhaps you know Alice too well.

It is an acronym Alice Asset limited, income constrained, employed.

In other words, the working poor, the obstacles confronting Arkansas's Alice households, and the struggle to overcome them are our focus.

In this edition, the latest, available and most reliable research indicates that more than a fourth of those households fit the Alice demographic.

One or more adults employed, but less than an adequate living standard requires.

So our nonprofit and governmental services, public and private, providing the assistance needed.

There is more than room for doubt.

We are joined now by the Reverend Chantel Hinton of the Winthrop Rockefeller Foundation.

And Reverend Hinton, thank you so much for making time for us.

Tell us how what is Alice?

How did it come about as a research project?

Absolutely.

Thank you for having me.

The Alice movement was a movement started by the United Way of Northern New Jersey, and many states began signing on because they understood the reality that the federal poverty level, which was adopted many, many decades ago, is too antiquated to really speak to the realities of working people who are still what you would consider the working poor.

So Arkansas, we decided we needed to have this research in this data come to our state, and we were around the 22nd state to join this national movement of others who are trying to elevate the conversation around people who are experiencing financial hardship and economic uncertainty.

So that's why we brought Alice to the state of Arkansas and the connection with with the Rockefeller Foundation.

Absolutely.

So I work for the Winter Rockefeller Foundation, which is named for a previous governor of Arkansas.

And he was really integral in creating the Economic Development Commission in Arkansas.

And one of the things that we wanted to do as we continue to build on his legacy, is to help move the conversation forward about what is going on with the economy in Arkansas.

So at the foundation, we have a focus on economics, education and social, racial and ethnic equity.

And so one of the things that we wanted to do was to make sure that we were changing the conversation, if you will, about those who are most times working two and three jobs but still cannot make ends meet.

And what sets Alice apart from other?

There are a lot of studies or NGOs that work on the on the issues involving the working poor.

What sets Alice apart?

I think there are several things.

First, you can look at the acronym itself.

It really gives you more of a human feel for everyday people who you see on your grocery runs, or when you're out getting your teeth cleaned, or when you're in the church pew.

You're seeing folks every day who are Alice.

And a lot of times we like to separate the issue as either something that doesn't involve us or as something that is a personal responsibility, as in, the individual is responsible for the fact that they are not making a lot of money.

And so one of the things that the Alice report really does is lays out how Alice is, as I said, working more than one job, but because of all of the cost associated with living in our state, they simply cannot make enough to support their families.

And they many times are one disaster or calamity away from financial ruin.

And so we find this report to be a very comprehensive look, not just a at the basics of, you know, what are the stat benefits that people are eligible for, but it really goes into what are the child care costs, what are the transportation costs, what are the technology costs?

What are the other things that oftentimes get overlooked when we're talking about financial security?

What?

But but there are other factors at work.

Are there or not?

I mean, other than just wage, other than just low wages or inadequate wages, there are many other factors involved in shaping who fits into Alice.

Oh, yes.

Yes.

And some of the things that we are trying to to take a more robust look at is not just the wages, because we do know in Arkansas we we don't have a very high wage, we don't have a living wage in the state.

So that is something we would love to see more focus on to get to a more of a living wage.

But we also are looking at the employment ecosystem in Arkansas.

We have some amazing small businesses and some some amazing local mom and pop shops that are employing people, and we want to create a conversation that will help employers to understand, okay.

Even if you can't pay a living wage, what are the other incentives and benefits that you could offer, perhaps around childcare or being able to take time off to be with your family so that these people who are Alice, who are really the bread and butter of our economy, are able to have a better quality of life.

Well, to what extent is Alice self-replicating?

I mean, we hear a lot about, you know, generational poverty.

Yeah.

Much of the data in the report, which if if you all want to see the report, you can find it at United for Alice.

We also have an Arkansas based website which is Alice in AR, but you can find the data there.

And really what we see in the data is that people who are Alice absolutely are stuck in generational cycles of being in poverty.

However, there are many other supports and conversations happening in our state, such as around the cliff effect, things that are supposed to help people who are working very hard, but sometimes makes it difficult for them to be able to move out of being Alice.

Those are the conversations that we want to continue having because as we know, we live in a pretty rural state that relies heavily on agriculture and manufacturing.

And now that technology is starting to shift the ways that industry is being attracted into our state.

There are other conversations that we need to have about the workforce development in our state as well.

So we are hopeful that this Alice report brings people to the table, and we want there to be unlikely partners, right?

We want there to be employers.

We want there to be financial institutions, private philanthropy, government education.

We want to have this conversation in a more robust way, because oftentimes we find that the solutions are not very long term.

Well, in terms of the tenor of the tone of that conversation earlier in the program, you said you wanted to change the conversation, but you also said you wanted to elevate the conversation.

Are we to prone those of us who may not be Alice?

Are we to prone to dismiss the families, the households of Alice, or to look askance at them?

I think so, Steve.

I mean, we have spent some time at the foundation really thinking about how do we share this narrative to to elevate the story.

Because, number one, we want people to be able to share their lived experiences with being Alice, with experiencing poverty in a way that dignified them, because most of the time we see when we talk about poverty, people typically want to go to abject poverty.

They want to focus on homelessness or things of that nature.

But we actually are focusing on the percentage of people, you know, 43% of Arkansans are Alice, and that means that several folks are not homeless.

They are working.

And so one of the things that we want to do is really humanize that experience, because we still see a stigma attached to people.

Either feeling like, oh, they're not working hard enough or, you know, they just need to go get another degree or what have you.

And sometimes that is absolutely not feasible.

And so elevating the conversation from the foundation's perspective, is about providing a more robust look at what people are experiencing every day and trying to push the conversation into the little P policy and big, big P policy space.

And what I mean, little p policy again, that's referring to, you know, are there community supports or employer incentives that people can begin thinking about to support?

Alice and Big P policy would then be, you know, things that we want to see in our state around health care, around child care, around education, that will be supportive of folks who simply cannot make ends meet.

I am struck by how often in the conversation thus far, you have turned to or referred to the private sector, as opposed to a government in terms of providing solutions or assistance to the Alice families?

Yes.

One of the things that we are up against, Steve, is that there is, again, a pretty strong stigma around how should the government be supporting its citizens of our state.

You know, there's there's been a lot historically that has been problematic around the ways we talk about welfare and social security and social safety net programs, and I understand where that comes from.

We want to be sure and name that Alice.

These are people who are working.

These are not folks who are trying to take advantage of the system, if you will.

And on top of that, we feel that it is not just on our government responsibility to be supportive of these people.

It's up to all of us.

One of the things that I really enjoy about this segment is that it talks about economics, public health, governmental affairs, and really what I want to do clearly in this segment is name that Alice really is a public health issue, because as much as we want our communities to be safe, to be thriving, to be a place where people want to stay and not leave, we have to talk about the health of our citizens, right?

And that means the the overall health.

I'm not talking about just the medical health, their well-being, their mental health, the supports that they need to be able to raise families.

And, you know, make sure that they have the things that they their kids need to thrive.

And so I think private the private sector really needs to be paying more attention to this conversation so that we can get past the stigma that oftentimes happens when we're talking about, you know, government welfare.

And, you know, people don't want to do a handout, they want to do a hand up.

We want to make sure that we are being inclusive and thinking about innovative solutions that possibly the government may not have the ability to do, but the private sector may well come by, whether it's public or private sectors.

The the social safety net as it exists now would seem to be.

Are you tell me is it is it is it failing the Alice families and those who are even more stressed?

It is.

It is not adequate.

I don't want to use the word feeling.

It absolutely is is helpful for those who need it, but it is not adequate.

And I mentioned earlier, Steve, about the cliff effect.

A lot of times people who are Alice aren't making too much to where they can no longer they can no longer receive those, those benefits anyways.

And so I think there's there's some questions around, how are we talking about, you know, snap electives and, you know, those types of programs.

How can they be how can they be tweaked?

How can they be changed to be more progressive, if you will?

I think our social safety net programs in a lot of our systems are starting to shudder under the weight of an economy that's just really challenging, not just in Arkansas, but in the nation abroad.

And so I will say that the social Safety Net program was amazing in its inception and conception, and we need to push the envelope on thinking more about what it can look like for the future ahead.

I cannot help but suspect, let's put it that way, that the changing nature of the workplace, the advent of artificial intelligence, is going to change the the work, the workforce landscape, the employment landscape to a degree that may not necessarily benefit the Alice families and the lower income.

That is correct.

And that is a major concern of ours.

We we love for Arkansas to be a space in a place where, you know, technological companies want to come and be, and we know that we have a pipeline of workforce development that we have to address.

Many folks who are Alice may or may not have a degree.

They may or may not have time to go get some type of continuing education.

And we want to be sure that when we're talking about artificial intelligence, which is amazing, which has allowed for lots of advancement, that it's not going to leave a large portion of our population behind.

Again, 43% of Arkansans are Alice.

That means that a lot of people who you see every day really are financially insecure.

And I think artificial intelligence is a space where you need to have time, you need to have opportunity, you need to have access to really good broadband and internet.

And we still have places in Arkansas that don't even have, you know, sufficient internet.

And so artificial intelligence is absolutely a space where Alice will be impacted in possibly left behind.

I suppose it goes without saying that that a child in an Alice household, that child's trajectory is life trajectory is is stressed in a way that a more affluent family would be the case would be the case in a more affluent household.

I'm not sure, Steve.

I think suffering and pain and trauma are no respecter of persons, regardless of of financial financial status.

But I do think when you are Alice, I grew up as Alice for a time.

You you work much, much harder because you know what's at stake.

I think for children now in Arkansas.

Who are Alice?

I'm curious about, you know, if they see themselves being able to go to college, if they see a pathway for themselves to go to a trade school.

Those are questions that I think every child ask.

It's just that when you come from a more affluent family, perhaps you already have that leg up, or you have the support system around you who are going to give you room to fail forward.

And that's really what we want to see happen.

More with Alice families.

What can the private and public sector be doing to allow for children to have space to dream and to be able to feel forward?

Because many times we know that people who are experiencing economic uncertainty, let's say they are first generation college student and they are Alice.

A lot of times they don't have anyone that they can call when they're at school.

They don't have any person that can put money for give them money for books or or classes, what have you.

We want to start seeing more, more than just scholarships.

We want to see a wholesale change in the way that our economy works, so that children who are Alice have room and space to dream and see a better future for themselves.

Along with this latest Alice report, there are a couple of other studies.

The Annie Casey report came in the other day, and The Nation Project, its report came in the other day, and both concluded that while there have been some incremental gains in Arkansas, and particularly in terms of the well-being of children, basically we're at best overall at best, where there's stasis, we're just in a holding pattern and in some some categories we're regressing.

Are you?

That's right.

That it is.

Is that or.

It's not discouraging?

I think it's telling us the story of the fact that in Arkansas, we're still we're still responding.

We're still reacting to what is our current reality.

To use a sports analogy, I am a big fan of basketball.

I used to play basketball.

We're still playing defense.

It feels like our economy is is experiencing a full court press, and we're playing defense, trying to catch up.

And what we really need to be doing is drawing up a play to, to to to convert to some offense.

I don't think it's discouraging as much as it is inviting more questions about what we could be doing differently.

I think that we are in a state and in a place where we have a lot of new energy as it relates to people who are in leadership from the government perspective and as well as like some of our nonprofits, we have some amazing nonprofits such as Arkansas Advocates for Children and Families, the Public Policy Panel, people who are really trying their hardest to make sure that we are keeping the right thing in front of us.

And so I'm not discouraged that our numbers have remained at stasis.

It makes me more hungry to keep having these kind of conversations with the right people at the table, and then also inviting Alice to be at these tables.

I think a lot of what keeps us at stasis, Steve, is that we have people making decisions that have never experienced poverty in their life, and that oftentimes is a recipe for disaster because you maybe you don't know what it's like to have to rob Peter to pay Paul, if you will.

So I think some of what I would like to see so that we can start turning in the right direction, is let's have more robust community conversations where Alice voices are centered, because most of the time, people who are closest to the pain and to the problem are also closest to creating the viable solutions that will move us forward.

We have about a minute remaining.

And let me ask you this.

Given the current political climate, how much of this is doable?

Are you are you optimistic?

I am optimistic about that, Steve, because one thing that I know about Arkansas is about is that y'all means all.

We use the word y'all a lot in Arkansas.

And yes, we we have very many different issues across race, across politics and and partizanship.

But this is an issue that touches everyone, regardless of what your political affiliation is or your zip code, no matter your race or your geography.

And so I have hope that we can sit down and talk about what does it mean to be a good neighbor.

I wouldn't be a good reverend if I didn't mention being a good neighbor, because that's really what is at the crux of this Alice conversation.

Got to end it there.

Reverend Hinton, thanks so much of the Rockefeller Foundation.

Thank you so much for your time.

Come back soon.

Thank you.

And we'll be back in a moment.

And now a closer look.

Two of Arkansas's Alice women, two working moms, both with the challenges inherent in the Alice existence.

One in northwest Arkansas, the other in the heart of the Delta.

Here they are, in their own words, presented by Reimagine Arkansas, sharing their stories with host Epiphany Morrow.

Northwest Arkansas is often noted for its influence and progressive ways.

However, in this region, like most in America, is a working class that still struggles to make ends meet.

Bernice Melkor lives within one of these Alice households.

She was placed in difficult situations despite her having a high demand city employee job.

I sat down to speak with her about her story and her current career, which started for reasons that surprised me.

So back in March of 2023, I received an eviction notice in my rental, which I had been there for ten years.

And and then just the process of having to move within 30 days and realizing that rents are higher than, you know, than what I was paying less housing just made me realize that my income needed to grow more because I was not going to make it with my my work salary and was eviction kind of like out of nowhere.

Or had you already had.

Yes.

Yeah.

Yeah.

Like me.

I don't know what was behind it, to be honest with you.

He didn't give me any specifics when I asked him, but he just said it was time for me to move on after ten years being there.

Wow.

The housing shortage crisis has a huge impact on Alice families.

Cost burdened housing occurs when a household spends more than 30% of its income on housing costs and, as a result, are more likely to face eviction and have fewer resources to pay for other essential items.

And what were you working before then?

Well, I had been working for the Benton County for the past ten years.

At that time, I was working for the prosecutor's office as a victim advocate.

Gotcha.

And what got you into that line of work?

Well, that was one of those things that I was just looking for a different opportunity.

Got into it and really found passion on it since I, you know, had been a victim of domestic abuse as a child, which I survived that.

And then being able to help those victims and give them voice and help them through their criminal process, just like really open a passion that I didn't know I had.

Gotcha.

So your childhood did that, I guess, Mark a lot of your childhood?

Yes.

So it was definitely hard as a child.

You never understand why your parent, who is supposed to be there to protect you, harming you, or hurting you.

So it was just really hard to understand that part of it.

But as I grew up, I always had a mindset that I'm not going to fall into those steps or that cycle because now I know it's called a cycle.

Bernice spoke to me about resilience, perseverance, and a vision of being better for children as keys to breaking the domestic abuse cycle.

Now, fight is more financial, but entrepreneurship has allowed her to be more present for children.

So tell me about your new business.

So our business is called Annabel's.

We started it in June of 2023, and we're basically focused on doing interior construction, such as siding or we do Chirag flooring cabinets, anything that has to do with interior.

We can do anything from new construction all the way to remodeling.

So that's kind of where we are.

And we're excited that it's just taking on cool.

And the finance has been better since you've been doing that.

Yes.

I can actually tell you that I don't struggle to pay my bills.

Now I have enough money to pay my rent and my bills, and I'm not like, struggling every paycheck to paycheck like I was before.

Oh.

Real dope.

What's other great parts about your new job?

So it gives me the flexibility to also be with my family.

So I have a child that is autistic and he needs a lot of therapy ot physical speech.

So it was a lot of when when I had a job, it was like I need to take off to take him here.

I need to, you know, and it was inconvenient not just for my, you know, my work, but also for me to have to always feel like I'm letting someone down, right?

Because I have to be absent from work, or I have to be absent from my child's life.

And this opportunity has granted me the flexibility to be more present in their life, more active, and the things they do at school.

So it's been it's just been really great for me.

Got you.

So one child, was it too?

How many?

I have three total, but the youngest one is autistic.

And and, you know, we've just been really blessed with him because he has shown us a lot of patience.

You know, a different road that we had not gone through.

But he's a very bright little boy and he's thriving.

And I feel like a lot has to do with me being more involved in his life than before, when I was at work.

Dope, dope.

So three kids, what's their names and ages?

The oldest one.

Her name is itself, and she's 22.

I have a middle child, Liam, and he's eight.

And then the the youngest one is Adric, and he's five.

Real cool.

Which one is your favorite?

I'm joking.

There's no favorite.

I'm not actually the middle one.

No, no.

Jokes aside, Bernice loves being a mom and really just family in general, which is why she was hit so hard when her mom was diagnosed with cancer.

But when they found the cancer, it was stage four and it was basically all over her body.

She had it in her lungs, her bones and her brain, so she deteriorated really quickly.

She stopped talking.

It was a lot of appointments going back and forth and, you know, and she passed away in that home.

And the one that I got invited from, I've had a chance to speak with you a few times before this.

How do you maintain your, like, positive energy?

Because you give off a very cool, like victorious radiance?

Well, I mean, I'll be honest, it's really hard.

Like, I feel like life has thrown a lot of curveballs my way, and I try to jump through those.

And there's times when I'm crying behind the scenes, right?

Like when I just need that cry and then I'm like, okay, I have to do it for my kids.

I have to keep going for my kids.

If you had a lot of your time and energy back from not needing to do so much, how do you think would impact your life and others?

Oh, I think I would have been a lot more present in my children's life.

I think that's one of the things that I job took away from me, the energy that I didn't have to give to my children.

And I feel like if I could go back, I would probably think about starting a business sooner, to have the flexibility that I have now to be able to provide more presence in my children's lives.

So what's next for you or any other grand aspirations that you would like, chief?

Well, right now my greatest want is to be able to have my own own my own home.

You know, I want to be able to have a home to provide a more secure environment for my kids.

Because right now I'm renting again.

Right.

So I don't know if they'll give me an eviction notice next month.

Like, you just never know when that's going to happen.

I'm very cautious.

I'm like, I hate to make my kids feel like this is home because we got kicked out of home.

You know, like, so it's just challenging for me to be able to give them that stability that they need in their lives.

Especially with autistic kids.

For my son.

Transition is the hardest thing in his life in any place.

So having him to move from house to house would not be suitable for him.

So I want to be able to provide a home that I can say, this is our home we're paying, you know, we can structure his room to be more sensory friendly for him.

Right now I have limitations because I'm renting.

I can't really provide that for him.

So that's my greatest dream, to be able to own my own home and and accommodate it for my kids needs.

I get it, I get it.

Hope it comes soon and when the time is right.

I know, like a real dope construction company.

There you go.

Yeah, right.

That's what we want to do.

Yes.

Although Bernice is in an improved position.

There's still so much that could be done.

It's unfortunate that the time and energy drink she's escaping from is still experienced by so many other households.

But I look forward to you getting that dream house one day, Bernice.

Until next time.

Yeah.

It's popular nowadays to say you should pursue your passion.

Your very few people do.

But here in the town of Helena, West Helena, a place rooted in both artistic greatness and historical atrocities.

I met Candice Dolls.

Who does?

We spoke on the path in art, family, loss, and the forever difficulties of being in the Alice household, much of which started when she moved from Dallas at the age of 11.

My dad, I think living a family life was kind of like kind of just slowing down a little bit.

So he told us, one day we're going, we're going to Helena to go visit your grandma.

And we packed up some weekend outfits.

It was like a three day trip, maybe some weekend outfits.

And we went.

And then when we got there, you know, it was all happy.

And he said, I'm going to the store to go get some, some cigars.

And he left.

And I was like, yeah, I was like 11 years old.

And he never came back.

Let me ask how many people were in the house.

So it was me.

My my my mom, my my two brothers and myself.

My grandma, my great grandma.

My grandma's sister and their brother.

So.

Squad.

Yeah.

Squad was there.

Yeah.

So I didn't have a bedroom the entire time growing up because it was just too many people.

You know what I mean?

So in my mind, I just wanted to leave here.

I wanted to make a lot of money.

That was my dreams, right?

Just leave here and make a lot of money.

My mom was like, well, what about, you know, your art and your fashion design?

Remember, you used to draw clothes and you used to design clothes.

Growing up with you.

Despite resistance at first and art school, Candace found it to be a cool like fit and thrived around the authenticity she found in fellow students.

She appreciated and often thanked her mom for the push.

So it's no surprise when her world changed drastically when her mom got sick years later.

So they go in and do a scan and they find cancer.

And so it was like we found out that in 2020, she passed in 2022.

So it was really quick.

And being a caregiver like how that impact, you know, I started looking at like, okay, slow it down and let's just be in the moment.

Like anything you want to tell me, you know, I love you.

You fall hard.

You know, you did your thing and I'm proud of you.

And.

Yeah.

Did the caregiver in the past, your mom, did it strain your finances in he.

Or was it something that was taken care of?

That's a that's really a funny question for me.

When you say when your finances and I can't really remember any time to my finances were just like super great, you know what I mean?

Candace had several jobs in Helena, West Helena, including where we met that afternoon at thrive.

It was a place she enjoyed due to the community work and in fostering creativity.

She currently works at the Delta Cultural Center, which is a job she also enjoys and has been promoted several times.

However, she still struggles to make ends meet.

In fact, in Phillips County, where she lives, 60% of the households live below the Alice survival budget and the change is subject to learn more about her life.

Asked about one of the dopest parts about being a mom, the devil is far about being a mom is when your kids.

They they feed you back.

What you been feeding them?

You know what I mean?

Not the other day, my middle son, Kanan, was trying to tie shoes.

He was having a hard time.

And I heard my daughter saying, Kanan, you are smart.

You handsome.

You can solve problems.

You can do this.

You're not a baby.

You're a big boy.

You can do this.

You are a problem solver.

And I was thinking to myself.

She sound like what I say.

What I tell her.

Yeah.

That's cool.

Yeah.

And what's the ages in the names?

Okay, so we got Brennan.

We call her honeybee.

She is seven.

Okay, we got Kanan.

He's five.

And we have Judah.

He's two, though.

And you said you wanted for more, right?

That's the good.

Oh, good.

Blue Monday hit us a painting that you really enjoy.

What about that stands out to you.

You.

Have you seen Blue Monday.

Yeah.

Once once you pointed out I hadn't seen it before.

Okay.

Well, when I saw that pain, I was thinking to myself, this, this artist, like, look into, like, the lives of everybody that I know.

Because I know that feeling.

I know that feeling of getting out of the bed in the morning and, you know, you got to attack the day, but you're so tired.

Oh, my God, you're just exhausted.

You don't see all day or or a break in sight.

You know what I mean?

And you just you go for it anyway.

You don't really have a choice.

You just go for it anyway.

That's all I've ever seen is women.

Strong black women.

Just.

I know they're tired.

I know that the resources are limited.

I know you don't have money like that, but you still get up and attack the day anyway.

No excuses.

And that's what when I see that, I just think of that like she's getting ready to go attack the day tired and all.

Well, I know you said a little bit earlier that it was a little bit nervous before speaking all about yourself, but I really appreciate all you had to share and been dope.

I really appreciate you.

Did it go smooth?

And I was hoping.

For many.

There's a projection of the American dream that if you just work hard and smart enough that you could reach it.

Unfortunately, this is more myth and reality for Candice and many.

She knows it's more the forever cycle of she's getting ready to attack the day tired and all.

And although she's making it happen.

Hopefully it won't always be at the expense of her energy and peace.

Until next time.

Yeah.

Those lives behind those lines of data.

Their search for something beyond just simple subsistence.

We are joined now by that pair of Alice Arkansans, Bernice Melcher of Bentonville and Candice Stahl's of Helena, West Helena.

Ladies, we thank you very much for being for being with us and for sharing with us.

Miss.

If I can begin with you and then go to Miss Dolls.

Miss Melcher, you said paycheck to paycheck.

Is it still that way?

Yes.

Unfortunately, it still is.

It's a little bit less sophisticated.

Meaning?

Like I'm not struggling as much, but that's because I. We open our own business, and that has helped a little bit.

But we're still trying to raise from that paycheck to paycheck.

What what does that mean in real terms?

You know, without without telling us what the paycheck is.

Where does it go?

How do you split that up?

What are your what are your expenses?

How do you meet them?

So for me, I had to stop working about two years ago because I have special needs children.

So my husband is really the only one bringing income.

And what that means is that we have to be very careful on what we spend our money on.

Sometimes we have to choose on whether we're going to be able to fix the car.

Like recently, my car had a car trouble.

So right now we're struggling with that and buying food.

So those are the things that paycheck to paycheck means for our family sometimes.

Yeah.

Candice dolls, let's go to you, if we may.

Is it a similar situation for you?

Yeah.

It is.

It's something similar.

It's just that that looming worry and anxiety about if anything were to come up.

How would I pay for that?

Aside from just overhead.

What sort?

Yeah.

Break down your budget for us, if we will.

Car?

No.

Insurance.

Groceries.

Utilities.

Things like that.

Yeah, that's about it.

Is there any room to spare?

Any breathing room in that budget?

Just a little bit, but not enough for a rainy day.

If something big were to happen.

Or if you want to go somewhere for the holidays or, like you said, if your car quits or, something happens with the plumbing or something, you know, something, one of the appliances goes out.

It's really hard to replace those things or or squeeze that into the budget when that, when those type of things come up for British Melcher.

Same question.

Do you?

How much leeway do you have in your weekly expenditures?

I would say sometimes it varies from 100 to 500, depending on our monthly projects that we have going on for our business.

What is the outlook right now for you and Bernice will stay with you for just a moment.

What's the outlook?

What's your attitude?

You just try to keep moving forward.

Sometimes it's it's hard because when you have to choose between, oh, I have to fix my car, or I have to, you know, by chicken or we're not going to have chicken this week.

But you also need your car to take your kids to therapy.

So it's it's sometimes unrealistic and you're not sure how you're doing it, but you just try to keep moving forward as much as you can.

There's times when there's going to be no chicken in the table, you know, but maybe the next week we'll, we'll have, you know, some sort of protein.

So it just I try to do it on a daily, take one day at a time and, and try not to think so much about tomorrow because sometimes it can be challenging.

Candice dolls your priorities when you when you start a new week in terms of of your finances, what are my priorities?

Yes, my priorities are always make sure the bills are paid and make sure that there's food on the table.

Those are the things I take care of first.

But in the event that I'm not able to do those things, I have community that help out.

You know, we have a lot of food pantries around the churches give out food boxes and things like that.

So I can I can squeeze, I can get by there.

The social safety net is it.

Do you feel it's working for you?

They say that once you make above a certain amount, you no longer qualify for that.

But, the hard part about that is even though you don't qualify for the assistance, now you have to pay for everything out of pocket.

And so it puts you back in that, that same tax bracket, if I'm making sense.

British.

Meltzer, do you find yourself in the same situation?

The higher your income, the less the less availability there are of social services, either governmental or nonprofit.

In other words, you can you can price yourself out of help.

Yes, that is very correct.

I've been through that.

Where we're in a bracket where we make not too much, but too much to get any type of services such as Nap or health care.

So it is very disappointing that we can pass that bracket.

We either have to be living in very poverty or make a huge jump to to, you know, skip that where you're not needing resources.

So it's hard and you feel like you're stuck in that bracket for I feel like I've been stuck in that bracket for, I don't know, the past five plus years where I can make that big jump to not need resources, but I'm also making too much to get their resources.

So, Candice dolls?

That sounds familiar.

Yeah.

Spot on.

That's exactly.

That's exactly what it is.

What's the alternative?

Do you see what are your options right now?

Candice will stay with you.

Do you see options?

Yeah.

Go ahead.

Well, what I do is I took on a second job, a part time job, and I try to catch little odd jobs or commission work.

I'm an artist, so I try to do things like that to, you know, fill in the gaps.

But yeah, that does not leave you with a lot of time, though, to yourself.

Absolutely not.

But yeah.

Bernice Melchior, the same situation for you or similar.

Yeah.

Similar.

Again, you know, for me it's a little bit more challenging because my daughter has very special needs and I have to be with her most of the time.

So it's even more harder to try to find a job myself to help my husband with the income.

But I try to do side jobs, you know, I do a lot of crafting and try to sell bags or cups and just trying to, you know, get a little extra money where I can find the opportunity for.

Do you think people understand your fellow citizens there, whether it's Bentonville or we'll go back to West Helena or Helen in a moment?

Do you think people understand your situation?

Bernice?

I don't feel like they understand it.

It's.

It's hard where you're not when you're not going through it.

Especially here in northwest Arkansas.

You know, housing has gone up tremendously.

You know, because of everyone moving here, since we have the Walmart home office, it makes it very challenging to even think in a future I'll be able to own my own home with the prices in the area and also everything going up.

You know, I feel like they're making Norway's Arkansas very attractive to people that come from bigger cities and the ones that we've been here since the beginning, it's we're the ones struggling to make meets in.

Candace, dolls, do you feel misunderstood?

No.

Well, not in this area.

I think there are a lot of people who who understand or are going through it themselves.

But sometimes when I'm in certain rooms, different, different groups are talking about Alice households and but they're talking about it as an experience apart from themselves.

So they talk about the data a lot, the statistics, but but not their personal experience.

So it is something that you do have to explain about.

And Alice household who who technically makes above the poverty, you know, the poverty line, but they no longer qualify for anything to have to pay for everything out of pocket, which again puts them back under the poverty line.

So it is something that takes a bit of explanation, but I don't feel misunderstood.

No.

British Melcher, what would you say to people?

I would say that, Alice, families are very hard working.

Families are trying to make the next step.

Right.

It's not that we're wanting to be helped by the government or things like that.

We are working very hard as much as anybody else is just wearing this bracket where we're stuck and we can't even move forward.

And so we just need more understanding that we're working as hard as we can to make that next step so people can see more than.

Oh, it's just a family that is not working hard enough.

We are working very hard enough, and I think people need to see that there's more than us needing resources or making it more challenging for the Alice families to to make the next step.

If you could get more of an obviously, you know, money, but but in terms of services among household needs, the very stuff of day to day existence, what do you need more of?

I feel like we need more affordable housing, more affordable health care.

As a business owner, it's crazy.

We can't afford health care, so we just need to be able to have affordable housing and affordable daycare for the families that need that daycare.

The health care also is just we don't have enough of that in terms of housing.

How much of a part of of your budget is the just a roof over your head?

Oh, that is probably, I would say, probably more than the 50% of our income.

Are there some familiar sentiments in what she just said?

No.

Yeah.

It's mostly the part about affordable health care.

It's always something that that scares you.

If something ever happens, how would you pay for that?

How would you get that paid for?

It's going to.

That bill is going to follow you, finding affordable things to to cook affordable health care.

If you don't have a community, you know, that can help you with your children, it's going to be a struggle.

But thankfully I do.

I have I have my grandmother who helps me with my children a lot.

So that's one expense I don't have.

But she's an elderly lady, so family is, at least for the time being, for you.

Candace Knowles families filling the gap or helping to fill that gap?

Yes, in my church family as well.

And Bernice Melcher.

Well, for me, again, it's just my husband bringing the income.

I have three under 18 kids.

I have a ten, a seven and a one year old.

So, and I just kind of feel in whenever I'm able to do some crafting and sell it on the side or, you know, find little markets to go and get that extra.

So, Bernice, would you is there a message that you would share?

There are so many other Alice families in Arkansas.

A huge percentage of our population is.

Is there a message you would share with them?

It's you know, it's so hard because every story is so different.

But one thing that is, let's not give up, you know, I know it's easier said than done, but I feel like there is some availability and food wise.

So always if you're struggling, reach out for the resources that we do have available.

You know, try to use those as much as you're able to and, and just keep moving forward.

Hopefully things will change.

That's the hope, you know?

But just don't give up.

Keep fighting.

There's going to be good times and bad times and we just need to stay as positive and as resilient as we can to keep moving forward.

Candace Dahl, same question to you.

Would you would you have a message to share?

Yes.

One thing that I learned from doing the Reimagining Arkansas Project about Alice households is that I think before I was thinking that it was more of a isolated, you know, situation for people that live in rural areas like myself.

But with that project, I learned that we all have really similar stories, and we're a lot more like than we are different.

And so just like Bernie said, just keep being positive, keep pushing forward, and you know it'll get better.

What about your situation in Arkansas and the Reimagine Arkansas program?

Yeah, that's been a very rewarding experience for me because it has connected me to other people's stories that you don't think you share a lot with your community, but you definitely do.

I mean, I have participated in this for, I don't know, I think the past 2 or 3 years, I can remember when we started with this, but just to be able to see that your story reflects with a lot of other people in the area and that you guys can make that connection and that we can be stronger together than being divided.

It's it's been a very exciting thing to to go through.

So I'm very thankful that I was part of that.

It's made a difference for you.

It has because it has made me realize that I'm not the only one struggling.

And also, like my story can be connected to other stories in many different ways so that we can definitely be stronger together.

Candice Dahl's You feel the same way or your thoughts will ask me thoughts?

Yeah, yeah, I do feel the same way.

And when we connect with different ones, like she said, we all have similar stories, different backgrounds, different walks of life, but we all connected in some way or another.

And something that I learned from the group was that some people were further along in their journeys, and so they kind of gave me like a blueprint of how to navigate certain spaces, you know, that I hadn't been in before.

And so very rewarding.

A lot of wisdom, a lot of things learned.

And I was really grateful for the experience.

Candace Dahl's Bernice Melcher, we thank you both so much for sharing your lives with us.

Thank you.

And that does it for us.

As always, we thank you for watching and see you next time.